Ep. 26 | Back to school - Jack Moran & Jose Goldner

Jack Moran and Jose Goldner share their entrepreneurial journeys with students at The Founders Club at the College of Charleston. Jack and Jose reflect on their early business ventures, failures, and the importance of mentors. They highlight the significance of resilience, strategic thinking, and creating systems to scale a business, providing practical advice for those just starting or considering their first venture.

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Host: Jack Moran
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I'm going to introduce our great speakers. Say so. Yeah. So thank you all for coming. tonight and I'll speak to our speakers. We're making it. We appreciate it. so if you guys want us to come up here, you're welcome. So we have, Mr. Mosaic owner, who is a partner at Pricks Capital. he has multiple years of experience, and honestly, a lot of areas of business, and owns multiple companies as well. And his business partner, Jack Moran, who's the founder of ecological Improvements and drinks beer. Yeah. And we'll just leave you with that for a little bit. If you guys can talk a little bit about your experiences. Founders Club is for people that are interested in startups or, already have startups, earn some money with that. So or we're going to do a little question and answer session at the end of that. Okay. Fantastic. Yeah, I'll get started. just kind of walk you guys through my experience a little bit, and then I'll talk about how I met Jose and then, you know, his background, and we'll go from there and just kind of wing it. always kind of been an entrepreneur deep down inside, like I say to people, I'm completely unemployable. I think I got fired from nine out of ten of the jobs that I ever worked. was like, as a kid, always, like starting lemonade stands, you know, shovel in for money, delivering ice to people's boats, like trying to figure out how to make money just for my buddies. And I, and then going into college, I still have that in the back of my mind, but had a ton of pressure from everyone around me. You know, you got to get a good job. you need to have a career. Start thinking about those things so you know, those I call them. Limitations were getting instilled in my mind. Like, maybe it's a crazy idea to think that I can start my own business. so I started going down the path that everyone else was telling me to go down, which was, you know, looking into environmental science, working on a cruise ship. There were so many different, like, ideas I was trying to figure out in college. And I had this, like, anxiety of, what am I going to do? so in the background was like still trying to start up a couple businesses. And I think the first one I did was when I was 18 years old, we try to start a music festival in Cape Cod. it was like a $1.5 million raise that I would have had to do. We went to a couple like investors to try to raise the money there. Like you're an 18 year old. I had no clue what I was doing. There was really no chance. Looking back, I would have approached that differently. I found, you know, a good lesson that I've learned later on is you really don't need as much capital as you think to start a business. there's a bunch of ways to, like, leverage marketing and sell pre-construction and sell your idea before you even have the idea and utilize that capital to get the idea executed. but yeah, I've learned through that process, that it wasn't going to be as easy as I thought to start a business and raise that money. so again, going through college, like, still trying to figure out what I wanted to do. and I had a professor, I was sitting in the back of this class. It was about environmental policy. super boring class, honestly. And I would just sleep in the back of it. and I don't know if it was, like, divine intervention or what, but I woke up one day during his class, and he was talking about how there was this $15 million contract available, at the beach near our school. I went to school in Massachusetts at a military school called, Mass Maritime. It's like the Citadel. and his point to us was that erosion is this massive industry that's growing, and there's not many companies that are doing this kind of work. and we should get jobs with the few companies that are that are doing it because it's a growing opportunity. The light bulb went off in my head like $15 million to do a marsh restoration, like do some plantings in a marsh. I could get like the wheels are spinning in my brain. I can get five of my buddies like, we'll go buy the plants, will install them and you can be fucking rich. so stayed after with him and like, I was basically like, you know what would stop me from getting that contract? And he's like, really? Your degree? You're going to be qualified for that kind of work. but you need to know the Clean Water Act, there's all this permitting that you have to go through. So that was like my first mentor I would start I started like, leveraging his resources in his experience, and getting a second hand education on, like, how to enter this business. now, it wasn't the first try that led me to the business that I have today. I tried a bunch of different models. At first it was like a consulting business. Writing the permits figured out quickly, like it takes a lot of training to be a consultant. There's a lot of things that you need to learn. So how many how am I going to scale this business up if I have to teach every person that I hire the, you know, thousands of hours that I'm putting into learning out how to do the learning how to do these permits. So like I was trying to get there quick. So that didn't seem like a good path. Then, try to start a nursery, growing the plants that were utilized for these marsh restorations, which there was a big need for them. We found out when we were trying to do the or get the contracts that not many people sold them. So again, recognize this opportunity, this market that hadn't been capitalized on, that people weren't offering this service, this blue ocean of opportunity and figuring out how to put this business together. so through that process, again, like ran into raising money, it was going to take$2 million to build this nursery. I didn't really know what I was doing, but finding mentors along the way, finding experts that could give me the knowledge, in order to start stringing this business together. And that's how I got introduced to Briggs Capital, which was an investment bank up in, Massachusetts. family friend of mine. I was working for him at the time, linked me. He wanted to invest in the idea, linked me up with his M&A guy who went through the business and started giving me my, like, next level of, mentorship. and you can see the recurring theme here, like finding mentors is really key. So he was teaching me like how to, you know, write up a business plan and how to do a financial summary and get the like, documents down on paper to model the business out before we raise the money to do it. So got all that done. And again, going to the table to try to raise a couple million dollars. And I start getting cold feet like I've been bullshit my way this whole time. Like, what am I going to do when I actually have to run this nursery? Like, I don't know anything about this. and luckily Covid hit, and kind of derailed that whole idea. So I had a lot of time to think during Covid, like, how am I going to restructure this business? And that's like when I started exploring models that require super low capital. So how can I start a business and and get into this industry without taking someone else's money on and like, figure this out on my own? So taking more of like a sales and marketing approach and like brokering deals and like selling something that I don't have and using the capital that I get for selling that to like make the opportunity happen. So I was thinking about business in a completely different way. and that was, you know, that turned into the business that I have today is like kind of following that model. we did like after our, you know, first year, you know, I drove down to Florida, packed up my life, lived in Airbnbs for a year with like $12,000 on a credit card, no money to my name. And I was just determined, like, no matter what happens, we're going to figure out how to make this business happen. And that's like, really the game of entrepreneurship. It doesn't matter the opportunity. It's like having the resilience and the determination that whatever gets thrown in front of you, you're going to find a solution and like, get over it until you hit the goal that you're trying to achieve. and it started out super brutal. Didn't know how we were going to put things together, but then, you know, little solutions and like little light, you know, light starts showing itself at the end of the tunnel. And I think, you know, within a year and a half of going down and starting that opportunity down in my car, we made a couple million bucks, like got jobs on Augusta National, Trump International. We're doing installs like next to the president. and like things just started clicking. But you know, each new barrier that we tried to knock down through new adversity in front of us and new challenges, and I started learning that system of like, when you want to get to the next level, the universe is going to throw like challenges in front of you. And those challenges are the, really the stomping ground for the the knowledge that you're going to need that adversity that you go through is going to be the knowledge that you need to get to the next level. so it's really a learning experience. but yeah, so once I made a couple million bucks, like the guys that were my mentors were basically like, congrats, like, let's go down to Panama. so we went down to Panama on a trip, with, like, all these high rollers. And that's where I met Jose, which I linked up with him immediately. Like, my intuition told me that this is a guy that could help me kind of take my company to the next level. and so I asked him to help me out with the business. I was trying to figure out how to build a relationship with him. And I can talk about that afterwards, like relationship building. And like when you see an opportunity with someone, like how to get them on your side. but yeah, I think I would pass it to Jose now and kind of give you your background and then we can just kind of roll with it from there, like what we're doing now and like blah, blah, blah. This guy's way more impressive than I am. That's a great story. so Jack came down and, and he's like, you know, can you help me with the business? And I said, you know, my first thing is, my first question is, are you an entrepreneur? So that's the thing you guys are going through now, like the just the fact that you're here is awesome because you're curious. Right? But the level of risk, the threshold of pain, right. And the relentlessness you have to have and the mindset and the process oriented thinking and the power making decisions every day. And the discipline and the habits, all of those things together is like what I call, you know, that's the material of a great entrepreneur. And if you want to be, if you think, you know, am I an entrepreneur? That's the first question is you should read what I do in my classes when I teach entrepreneurship is I teach biographies or autobiographies. Spaced out Steve Jobs, I'll teach Warren Buffett, I'll analyze the personalities in front of people, like, because you're going to find people that are more like you, right? And so you're going to communicate with not every mentor suits you. So the first thing is like getting a mentor that suits you like Jack, I'm like, Jack, I did that when I was your age. You're going to go down a rabbit and then I'll come with you. We'll crash and we'll hit every single tree limb on the way down. And so as a teacher, you got to be patient and be like, okay, we're we're going to hit everything. And then I'll be there. I'll say, you know, I'm not going to tell you I told you so. But, you know, I understand when I meet a mentor like, okay, this is the path this person is going to take. And so the thing is to understand people that are the, you know, books and mentors before you so you can understand, like, okay, this is my way of thinking. I'm extroverted, I'm introverted, you know, Myers-Briggs, you know, I might concrete sequential might abstract random. I might have a strategist versus an operations guy, which, you know, you're always in conflict in business because you can be a great strategist, but you really don't know how to operate anything. And I joke around all the time. I'm like, I can't even run my household. I'm married to a lawyer and she's a CPA. I'm really good with money, and she runs my whole time. Like, I don't even know when I leave my house if I go left or right without her saying, go left, go this way. But that's not my job. My job is to think and to strategize and look at markets and understand, you know, global things that are happening, you know. So, so I think understanding other personalities before you will give you great blessings and great strengths. Read about entrepreneurs, read about their makeup. Right, because that is the way that you're going to be able to perceive who's going to be able to help. You know, I couldn't sit next to a Warren Buffett and be like, I'm going to learn from this guy. I can have a great conversation with him, but that's not my personality type. I'm more likely to learn more from it. Doug Turner and I called them out from the South. One of his kids went to school in the Citadel. Like, he's more fast paced. He's more more of a sales guy. He's more business development. He's more strategist. And he would download his operation and do it and do a process and and the people below. Right. So I have like I learned very quickly how to grab an idea vetted out and turn it into an operational situation where I have the people running the business and I teach a class that's just how to own a business versus run a business, because I I'm not good at running businesses. I'm, you know, I'm good at owning businesses and having an idea and putting it in a place. And I'm meticulous about a manual of operations and a strategy operation and documenting everything that saved me. But I learned it from these guys. I don't $300 million a year company, and they're like, okay, you're going to tell something to somebody, you're going to forget about it. You're going to come to us saying, did you do that? Like, no, we forgot about it. So the idea is like, it's gone, right? So documenting gives you the freedom of time because I tell you one thing and that's it. I can forget about a it. Now I'm just checking the metrics. If you do this, if you do that, you do that. So so that's like, you know, you need to understand your personality and where are you are you over here. And strategy big ideas abstract random you concrete sequential operational. So you need to be able to straddle those kind of things. What was your entrepreneurial journey? I think everyone wants to know what you do. Well, so I studied literature. and when I finished college, my father said, well, he was a lawyer, entrepreneur. So I learned at home how to be an entrepreneur. He said, well, you piss four years of tuition money away because your mom said, study literature, study what you love. Because my mom was kind of a little bit hippie or something, what you love. And so I studied poetry, fiction. I got a minor ethics, and I studied literature, American and British. So that's what I loved. And then I got into college. I'm like, well, here I am, no job. So I started teaching and I couldn't, you know, Latin America, you're barely making a living. Teachers that were 50 years old, older, they had three jobs and some like so I started at the bottom. So what are the great advantage? Like, there was no way for me to go further down in terms of all right. So I'm like, okay, well, I can do anything, right? So I started a, a job in a, in a internet because the internet was beginning back in those days in 94, 95, literally beginning. So anybody who was an expert. So I got a job, I worked eight months in a, in a business and I decided, you know what? I'm so creative and so gung ho about things that I want to start my own business. And I started that business, and I decided to go into voice over the internet, and voice of the internet was beginning Skype and WhatsApp and all these so that it was back then it was traditional networks, and this was the first time that a phone call was going over the internet. So I started a telecom companies and I started opening up channels in Latin America, bringing minutes from all over the world into these little tiny servers using satellite because there was no fiber back then. We took the company. I was like 27 years old. We took the company public, we made a couple hundred million dollars, and I was like, wow. It was like, I mean, I was burning the candle on both ends. I did not like an actual joke. What are you talking about? Your tire. You know, when we're running crazy because you learn the speed, right? And so I was working 16, but I was. I was running on adrenaline. I just love working, and I still do. I'm like, someday let's work. What else is there to do? This is fun, right? Not to say that we don't have fun, right. But so anyway, so that was kind of my journey. And then I was very lucky that I had great mentors. And they taught me systematic thinking that like, don't sit here, can you shoot bop, bop, bop, everything in the air. And so you got to have a clean that's what they call it. You got have somebody like, what do we do with this? What do we do with that? Like I'd be like, oh, I got a good idea. I was drinking with my friends. Or, you know, I come home and I give it to my cat, and I kind of goes, you ready to lose money for six, seven years? And I'm like, really? God, I must have been really drunk that last night, right? Because you're going to have an idea and you're going to have to have, you know, we call it drinking the Kool-Aid when you think you have the greatest idea ever, and then you run it by other people. They're like, this is your idea. You know, some black and white. So you need to balance your personality to vet things out in your own brain because you can literally, like, become insular and think you've got the greatest idea ever. And it's not. So those are kind of like things that I learned early. You know, when Jack came to me, I'm like, do you have a business? You know, I mean, the first thing is, I said, I want you to come and live in Panama for a year because I want to see. Do you get up in the morning every day at 6:00 in the morning to start working? I want to see you here drinking coffee with day six. No, I want to. I just wanted to see if you have the makeup of an entrepreneur and the of entrepreneurs. It's all about habits. But if you don't have the habits and you're like, oh, you get up at 910, you're chill on this side. You're like, I'm not going to present, you know, entrepreneurs are an entrepreneur is running at another speed. You think different. You act different. Like, I don't have friends that are corporate guys. All my friends are crazy entrepreneurs. You got to be a little bit on the edge. That's just your person. I look at read of entrepreneurs, you know, and that's a little bit biased, right. But anyway, so he said, I'm moving. And he moved right next to me in the house and in Panama, in the middle of nowhere, a little fishing village, you know, so a year went by and I said, this is what I'm going to teach you. I'm going to teach you how to do a business plan, a manual of operations. I'll teach you the numbers. And then I'm going to give up the first plane and go to the first meeting with you. And when I when I went to the first meeting, I was like, I'm going to tell you, yes or no, there's a business or there's not a business here. And I said, you're in a $44 billion a year problem erosion. There is a business. So being in a business that has a big market, you know, the first thing is what problem of my solving how big is the market? What is the size of the opportunity. Right. So you got to know, like economically where our country is and what they're doing. Like I looked at I love real estate. It's my favorite thing ever. I look no matter if even if I'm on vacation, my wife is like, can you be a normal person? I just sit in this pool and drink something and just chill. No, no, I'm going on a real estate tour. I got a broker and I'm like, right now she's like, this is no fun. But I want to look at real life. I want to look at pricing and look at construction cost. I want to look at, you know what I mean? Like, I want to look at the curve of what's happened. And transact is like, you get obsessed like this, but I can come to trust and tell you I don't see a real estate opportunity. I see a overinflated. So you naturally build a criteria for whatever business you're in. As an entrepreneur, you become agnostic. You know, like, I can walk in a restaurant, I look at, I count the tables, I count the turnover account that the that you know what I think the average price is per ticket for each person. Like that's just what happens to you. You know what I mean? You're you're you don't there's no off switch. And so you build this criteria that helps you to become a that's why Richard Branson how many businesses the 2030 who knows right. I know guys that know. And he's just like he'll always listen a new idea. If it's good, he'll cut you off in five minutes. I'm sorry. Not interested. Because you'll immediately. That's how fast he can put it together with the pressure. I said there's nothing here. Right? And hedge fund guys and venture capital guys and I do venture capital. So I'll listen to your DNA. And I ask you 3 or 4 questions in the meetings. Okay. So you know, I don't see it. I don't see the connection. So anyway, his promise of $44 billion, you got something? You know what I mean? And so all that I help them to do. And this is what I love to do, I. I'm a teacher in the end, but I love to empower them with knowledge to take the business in from strategy to operations. And then it's all about the metrics. How many phone calls would you make? How many emails went up? How many proposals went out? What's your pipeline? If you go from five to 10 to 15, 20 million, right. Because in the end, if you stay in that abstract world of ideas and you don't download it into specific, measurable results day to day, that's where the habits come in. You got you're not going to succeed. And then, you know, a guy told me one time, he said to me, he said, okay, you're really, you know, you're personable. You go out and you know how to connect with people. And you're you're great at developing businesses and relationships and all that. But you're not going to be successful. Didn't go, oh, stop. Wow. What do you mean? And he said, because you don't know how to multiply yourself, you've got to. It's very different. If you go to a company, you go to somebody, you go, I can make 1000 from myself. I can replicate myself. I can share my knowledge and replicate it with a thousand people that do what I do. And I go, what? I went home and I don't go. So he told me, you got to do scripting. You got to do the right. You got to do it. You got to have a system in place. So all of a sudden it clicked in my head. I'm like, wow. So I can have two, 3000 people that have my knowledge that are going out there and getting market share. You know, that that does is so mean that it's it's people that you're training. You could have a digital ecosystem, a strategy that multiplies your knowledge and what you're doing in another medium to grab market share. So it's all about like how do you expand, you know, that idea who you are to to to get to grow your business. Right. That makes sense. Yeah. And I think like we could talk about a million different ideas of entrepreneurship. I'd rather just like, turn it to you guys and have you guys ask questions, because it's better that we talk about the things that you're interested in and like the, the challenges that you're facing. right now and your, your own journeys. I think that's like a much easier way for us to, like, pass our knowledge on to you guys. What's up? What you got there? You have that, All right. So what would you say? So right now I'm kind of looking to to get, like, sort of senior now, so kind of round out the end. So I'm looking for a job now or an internship. So what would you say? So sort of steps are that you recommend or for both of you. it's for, for myself to, to kind of get my foot in the door with a, sales or restart real estate kind of area. Yeah. So I would say like, it's a very simple process to enter into the entrepreneurship game. First of all, no matter what you do, there is no easy way to get around it. The universe is not going to allow you to make millions of dollars without going through pain. so that's number one. Now, if you're going to have to endure that pain anyway, you might as well pick something that you like. So I would say number one is like, figure out what the hell you want to do for like the next, you know, in your entrepreneurship career, you can exit a business in 5 or 6 years and go on to the next thing, but figure out what you're going to want to be putting 70, 80 hours a week into, like, if it's boring, it's going to be and you don't like it, it's going to be very difficult for you to put in the amount of time that is required to succeed as an entrepreneur. I, I have an exercise that I do with students. I take them to a bookstore and I put them in front of magazines and I go, I'm going to give you 10s to pick your favorite magazine, and they pick their favorite magazine. And I see how you pick that magazine. Once you pick that magazine, they go, because I love this and I love reading this, I love this and I love it. And they tell you all about the magazine, right? That's how you should choose entrepreneurship. It's something that you're academically enthralled with intellectually. You love it. You read it on your free time, do not have a division between your free time and your business. It won't happen in entrepreneurship. It's one in the same. You know, like when I'm working, I'm having a blast. I'm having fun, right? So that's the first mistake. And and going back to your question is when you're this is one thing I say to people that are in startups. I say, if there's one day you're not learning from what we're doing with Jack, quit. If there's one day you don't feel like right. You've heard me say that a million times. Today works with us. I say, if you're not learning something and you're not excited to quit and go do something else because you're in the wrong place, you know, so that you have to have that kind of energy and that kind of passion, right? So obviously a startup is a startup. If you go to a established company, you're in a cubicle that it could take you five years to learn all this stuff. So I would the more you get closer to the experience that you want to replicate, the better. So do a startup. That's where you're gonna learn entrepreneurship, starting. It's going to be chaotic, and people of handle chaos. A lot of people go, oh my God, this is disorganized and this is not. And they give me a thousand instructions and I, you know, we're running out of money. And they didn't pay me this. I mean, you're gonna you're gonna feel that calm. You gotta embrace that chaos and be like, how would I handle this? And the worst thing you can do single handedly, the worst thing you can do. And I see it all the time, is gauge the opportunities that you enter based on how much money you're going to get immediately. You should gauge it by how much knowledge you're going to get, because that knowledge, the money comes and goes the knowledge. Once you have it, they can't take it away from you. And that's where the money comes from. So you want to gauge the opportunity with how much can I learn from this opportunity? And is it aligned with my end goal? And like I follow a very simple process for people that are trying to enter like entrepreneurship, identify your goal, like whatever it is and dream big because again, it's like you're still going to have to it's going to be a lot of work, so you might as well go for something big in my opinion, but identify that goal. Whatever it is, then number two is visualize how you're going to get there. And like if you guys are taking notes, write down the word visualization because visualization is the it is the key. Like you generate your. And I'll have you talk about visualization afterwards. But so let's just say your imagination creates your reality. You know if you're thirsty and you want to grab a glass of water and you're running outside and you're in the sun, what do you do? First you imagine, imagine you go to the refrigerator, opening a refrigerator, grabbing the jar, you know, cold water. You pour it into the glass. You go through the steps of the imagination to create a reality. There's no difference in the universe, but you can't, like, visualize that dream about doing it and like, stop. You know what I mean? You've got to keep going with the idea. If your idea you're not thinking about every day consistently, that then there's something wrong there, because it's got to be something you're so passionate about that it lights, you know what I mean? It's like being in a relationship. If you're in a relationship, like your interest for that person has to be relentless. Every day it's a different person. You're perceiving a different person. You're you're excited. Oh my God, who's this person today? They're this and or that and they're you know what I mean? Like, it's got to be like that. You can't wake up the next day and be like, oh, I'm going into this routine of, you know, excited. Yeah. So so the process, I go through it like this. Identify your goal, like write it down, visualize what it is that I want and how long does do I want it to take to get to that goal then? So you've never been through this path before. You don't know what it's going to take to get to there. So you have to visualize like what is my plan to get there? And just that visualization. You're probably going to come like 70, 80% of what you have to do. for me, it was like I knew quite blatantly, I got to quit drinking, I got to quit smoking weed, or I'm not going to be able to put in the amount of time that's required to do this. So those were two things that were like firing off in my head that I knew I had had to do if I wanted to be successful with my business. For two years, I pretended that that wasn't a thing and I could get around that. Although in my head I knew that that was the key. I kept pretending that that wasn't an issue. it wasn't until I actually, you know, gave in to the things the universe was telling me that I started seeing the results. So part of my, like, visualization and plan, those were two things. But there was a lot more to that plan. So visualize your plan that you're going to take to get from where you are now to whatever that goal is that you've identified, and then execute that plan. Do what you said you were going to do. If you do half of it, you're going to get half of what your goal is. You know, if that start executing on that plan. And what's going to happen is, again, your plan is probably going to come 70, 80% of what's required to get to your goal. But along that path, you're going to run into adversity. And that's where the boys are separated from the men or the the the black hunters are separated from the gatherers, you know, because a lot of people will go back to that comfort. They'll say, like, things are getting hard, it's not working out. And they'll turn around where there is a will, there is a way, if you are determined to get to that goal, a solution will present itself every single time, no matter how big the problem is. You just have to have that mindset that no matter what falls in front of me, I am going to figure a way to get get out of it. And it's funny how like, the world shows you the answers, but it's going to put you through that pain so that you learn and it gives you the exact tools that you need for the next step of your life. It's funny how it works out. So you're going to encounter that adversity and just find a way to get over it. And over time, like you're trying to get to this goal and you're going to head down this path and you might turn right, and that might be the wrong way, and you're going to hit that adversity and you either make a wrong decision again. but you're going to learn from each time you hit that adversity and eventually your path is going to get like so tailored in that that path that you are on will eventually intersect with your goal. So it's just a repetitive process. Execute your plan, expect the adversity. Find a way to get over the adversity. Be learning along the way. And eventually, if you follow that path without quitting, the only way you can fail is quitting. You will intersect with that goal. So how do you enter? Like your question is like, how do I jump into real estate? It doesn't really matter what the opportunity is to define what the goal is that you want. And follow that process. I guarantee you you will stick with that goal. But if where the 99%, you know, they say it's 1%. I mean, for me it seems like 100,000 people have what it's what it takes. Like, I have met so many people that say they want to go down this path, and they just hit the adversity and they can't get through it. They go back to the comfort to what they're used to, and that's what makes the difference. You have to keep learning, you know, you gotta you've got to I mean, people, you go to university, you study and you're on a regimen and plan. And really, that's the beginning. I mean, like, you know, we have a class every single day, 8 to 9 every day. And we read a book, analyze the book. And I go through each paragraph, each word, each concept, and we go, because, you know, how many books can you read in university? 100 books, 200 books. How many can you read in your lifetime? 2000? 3000. How fast can you learn? I mean, I'm a I was a literature teacher. My friends were like, what? What do you know about designing communication networks? I'm like, nothing, but I'm reading a lot, right? You know? And so you can't be afraid to be, you know, to enter into that territory of like, not knowing. And you've got to have that kind of mindset, like, I will learn everything there is to learn. So I call a possibility thinking. And, you know, you could talk a little bit about that possibility and possibility thinking. Right? I mean, I'm always like as a leader, you are a possibility thinker. You think of all the possibilities, not the impossible. You rarely spend time on the obstacles. You're like, oh yeah, I got this again, but I'm going to pass this. And that's why it's important to read biographies, because you see how other people overcame obstacles, and there's always going to be those obstacles. And if you guys start a business and you guys start having employees, you will see people that are very good at identifying problems. But that is like not helpful at all. Like the leaders and the people that are successful are the ones that don't give a shit about the problem. They're just always going to find a solution. so that's something that we try to teach is like be a problem solver, not a solution or a problem identifier. It's not very helpful. It's very easy to see when there's a problem in front of you. next question. What is your question? I was going to say, I think I know many people in this room kind of have these business ideas. Or maybe they're, you know, that's took a couple of steps forward. But I've kind of gotten to the point where maybe, you know, they don't have the capital to start a business. And you mentioned you mentioned something about brokering deals and possibly like leveraging that. Could you maybe talk a little bit more about that? Maybe you know, how you don't have to have money to start the business and other ways to there. And I can answer that. Like whenever, but when anybody comes to me and says, oh, you need money to make money. I mean, I say, that's that's the first thing goes on my mind, oh, I need to raise money to do this business. I immediately go, that's not because I believe that with a great idea. That's all you need. That is money. That is capital, right? Because you now have the power with that great idea to tell one of a person that goes, wow, I believe in this. Steve Jobs in the garage. You know, he had an idea. He told Steve, and he told another one he don't know. And they believed and they said, so if you're a leader and you're mission oriented and you have an idea, the money will come, you know what I mean? And there's a lot of other things you can use as currency other than money. You can use equity of your business and the the futures of your business as currency to pay people and get things done. You can use, knowledge, you know, if you have experience and someone wants to learn from you, you can utilize that to pay people in the front end. Yes. And that's what I was kind of asking, like, what are the other opportunities that you have to start a business, maybe equity or knowledge and maybe you talk a little bit more and I think like, I mean, I really like the like pre-construction model and like it's a real estate model for development, but you can use it in any business, like if you have an idea, don't so many people, they put all these resources into like building the website and like getting the teams together and they don't even know if they can sell it. They haven't even brought it to market yet. So like, for example, if I want to purchase, let's go back to the music festival that I failed at the first venture that I ever did, I needed thought, I needed a million and a half dollars or close to $2 million, to hire the acts to put together the stage, to get the venue and get all those things and don't even know if the the concert sold yet. If I could go back, what I would do is I would put a couple thousand dollars into a marketing video for what the business is going to be, what the opportunity is, the music festival. That would be my capital investment. And then I would go out and sell tickets like 2025. We have a festival coming and see how many people you know. Now there's going to be people that are like, they don't even have the book yet, so I'm not going to buy a ticket, but there's going to be people that are down and out, relate to your idea and are excited for it. So go out and sell tickets and raise a couple hundred thousand dollars. Then book your headliner. You know, use that capital from the ticket sales that you've got and you're generating this momentum to book your headliner. Now you have a headliner. Now you can raise the ticket sales and just keep running that system until you've raised all the money through selling on the front end. so that model works extremely well. It's a very low risk model for entering the entrepreneurship game. That's how I do all my business is now you guys can read about startups that start with no money. I have a friend of mine and I love this story. And you know, he was in his 20s and he started like studying this highway in Boston of all the cars moving through. And he's a mathematical mind. He's a lawyer, kind of very concrete, sequential thinker and really good at financial spreadsheets. And he was driving the cars and he bought a farm. He didn't buy a farm, sorry. He optioned the land of a farm. So the farm was worth millions and millions of dollars. And so he I said, how much did you pay the auction on it? And so he paid an option, which means that he had a certain amount of time to sell the land and give the guy the money back. So he paid him $50,000 and he got on loans. He got some friends and he gathered the money together. He paid the auction in real estate, and then he did a master plan with a friend of his who was in university. So he did all these stores and put the logos in the names of all these stores. And he developed like a little master plan. I went, sold it to Walmart, can buy us all these different retail stores. He sold the whole entire thing, made $200 million, and then he paid the guy that he had the money to and land his own land that was now worth more money. Yeah. And then I said, okay, you know, I'm just dumb farmer. And I said, no, you're not. He jokes right about it, but he would just do it over and over again. So like, I buy oceanfront surfing and fishing properties and people look at me like I have three heads because they're like, you're nuts. Nobody's ever going to come out of here, you know? I mean, why would you ever do that? Dirt roads and farms. You got to go an hour and a half by boat. It's like being on an island, you know what I mean? But I know the type of person that looks at that and goes, oh, my God, you know what I mean? This is so I'm a market maker. I have to create. I've created a destination before, you know, it didn't exist. There was no name to it. There was no tourists, there was no nothing. So like, you have to have such a like my mother and my father literally call my sister one time. I'm the eldest of six. It's like you've got to intervene with your brother because he's buying this land in the middle of nowhere. After the. I sold a couple companies. Is that because I think he's gone off the deep end buying this land? Now you need to get him a psychologist. You know there's something wrong with him. You know, like, you know, parents are parents, right? Something like, what are you guys? What are you talking about? I know what I'm doing. I see the models, I do, I, you know, obviously you can't, you know, shoot from the hip, get the data right. Like this guy that that was counting the cars. Right. Get the data, get the models, like back up your things with information. Right. But if you have a conviction, right. Like Warren Buffett's great at it. You know what I mean? His favorite thing is like, you know, be greedy when people are fearful and be fearful when people are greedy. Like, make sure that you have that north and then nothing is swayed because everybody will tell you why not to do it. Everybody will tell you Steve Jobs, they would call it the Steve Jobs reality distortion field. Here he comes with his twisted reality distortion. He's outside of reality is what they would say. And he would make it happen time and time again. Right. So you have to have that part of being entrepreneurs, having that strong conviction and not letting anything sway them. And I'll talk about two other, like real quick, two other models that I think are like good ways to enter entrepreneurship. One is being just like a man. I call it a manufacturer rep. And you're like essentially a broker. Find a really good product, negotiate a commission plan for that product, and then go out and sell it. Everyone needs leads. Everyone needs to generate business for their company. So it's very valuable to be able to say, I can source clients for you, and then take that commission that you would have gotten for selling that product and reinvest it into your next employee and develop a team of salesmen, that are moving a product. That's a very easy way to start a business that, is low capital, very valuable, to any business. There's a there's a friend of mine. His name's Gary Keller. He has a real estate company called Keller Williams, and he wrote a book, the real estate agent. Look up Gary, Gary Keller. The book, and he'll actually teach you how to go from being a broker for you, that you like real estate and to forming an organization from one person to. So you want to read books that help you from, you know, you as an individual to an organization. So that book, The Real Estate, the Millionaire agent or something like that. And the third model that I'll talk about and I wish that I, you know, how to model like this. I have some buddies and we've done some podcast with guys that are doing really well at online businesses. but if you can figure out a way to again, with that, like manufacturing rep model, it's very easy to automate that. online. so if you can take a sales process like this is how we grab attention of a client and put them into a funnel, this is how we get them to put their information in. then walk through that sales process and you can automate that sales process online. Very low capital. You're not dependent on employees. Which employees are the hardest part of the business? you become a therapist, motivating people and keeping them like, you know, in tune with the idea where is if you can automate that business, you don't have to, you know, rely on that. so, like, you see, like, the biggest companies that are getting the highest valuations are software companies. They're building a software that works on its own, and then they're creating a digital marketing strategy that finds clients, nurtures them, and converts them all automatically and sells this product. And this entire business is running and producing income independent of people. so those models are super, super cool. if you want to look into that. so you all talk a lot about mentorship and, how important it is. I think a lot of the time, especially for me, like, I'm, you know, specifically trying to find a, a good mentor in a, in a certain industry, like an industry like for my business that I work in. How would you go about, like, do you have any suggestions on finding good mentors and how to approach people that maybe could be a mentor, but you're not really sure how to, you know, get them to work with you. You know, that can be find the guy that is like the example of what you want to be and is doing the things that you want to strive to be, and then find a way to get next to them and absorb from them. but I will say, like the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Like if you're afraid to approach that person and they don't know you at first. So originally, like they're not going to give you the attention, but keep on them. And like if they're an entrepreneur and they're successful and you stay on them, they're going to respect that. And that's how they're going to give you their time. You can be amazed at how many people will open the door, but they will put you to the test. You know, like, I have a lot of people that I want to work with. You want to learn this. And then I put them through a little test because, you know, we don't want to waste our time. And, and I have mentors as well. But I went through that I have nobody makes it on their own. You know, I have seven guys pull my hair like, what do you know, go, you know, so like, being open to learning, you know, because you want to be with people that that you're sharing. I'm learning from Jack and all his team just as much as they're learning from me. I tell my own children, I'm 1% of a mentor for you guys. Go get the 99%, you know, so people that are successful will want to share that, but they want that genuine interest. Yeah. And that authenticity. And you want to also, one thing that's very important for you guys is that we're teaching a class right now on it is personal branding. You know, like who are you? What's your mission? What's your purpose? Have a killer LinkedIn. Read about LinkedIn because that is the business platform right now. But also your name should be out there. You know, when people Google you, you should know, wow, this guy loves this and he loves this and he loves this. And also something that that the professor I read a little bit about, some of the stuff on the internet about you. And like when you talk about sustainability and you talk about like good causes, environmental with that, like have a cause that you care about because, you know, like I've had friends of mine that are, pretty, you know, significant people in their field. And they always have a great cause. They're always helping other people. They're always doing something environmental, are always so like, that can be a big door opener for you guys. Like being involved in a nonprofit. You know what I mean? That because that shows an entrepreneur like, okay, this person really cares. I really want to help, you know, you're just not enough for just yourself. You're you're actually making the world a little bit of a better place, right? Yeah. That impact driven. Cause branding is, like, really important. It'll build a lot of momentum for you, and you'll get a lot of free shit, you know, like, people will help you out because you have a good impact. but I'll say, like, a good rule to follow when you're looking for mentors is like, do 5 or 6 things for that person before you ask them for anything you know, like be a giver first and the, people reciprocate. So a question back here, but it's just that I've run multiple instances of pressure and am I right after like six figure college business. And my question is based more around how do I know? so I always see myself, even if I do, I will see myself use my degree. So how do I know when to cut off? Pull the ripcord? Yeah, a little bit. How I know to cut off school to the extent of I know it's taking time away from my business where I can do a ten x what I'm doing that, I'll let you take that on that. Like, school's not just about, you know, learning business and after you do after school, I think I think school, you develop a lot of friendships. You know, I think that school teaches you, social responsibility. There's so many things that school teachers do that has nothing to do with, like just driving your business that, you know, I would just encourage you to, like, take leadership roles and to develop friendships and develop social skills and, and do things above and beyond, you know what I mean? Not just look at the business for business. Like I have incredible friends that were in my fraternity that I, you know, hung out with in college. They're my network in high school, I went to boarding school, you know, so don't just like, get because you don't want to be that guy that is like just the tunnel vision. And then you're not like, I'm a little bit unorthodox with school. You know, obviously I studied literature and, like, I would take art classes. I would take, like, all the classes you can possibly take, all the electives. I take every summer in college, you know what I mean? Because look at Steve Jobs. I love to use this example, Steve Jobs, the reason the iPhone was an iPhone here. Yeah. Okay. Can I see what the reason that the iPhone is round like this and beautiful. This it was one class lobster and it was a calligraphy class before he dropped out. And then the calligraphy class. He loved the curves. And he said the computer doesn't have to be square. The computer can be curved and it can be. And he got into esthetics right. So there's classes that you don't know like everybody like, oh, this is never going to help me. Why am I studying this? You never know. You know what I mean? But being a well-rounded person and I believe in being a, you know, kind of a Renaissance person, you don't want to be sitting in a conversation. And like, all you talk about is business. You're going to be pretty boring, you know? But if you're talking about, like, plants and you're talking about art and you're talking about all these different things like, wow, this guy is super interesting, you know what I mean? So college, what a great environment. You know, where you're just like, you can do all kinds of things and talk to different people, get interesting, like, like take advantage of that. Right. So don't just think like, oh, I'm doing this and this is what I'm going to do. And you know, like enjoy this beautiful time because it is an incredible, magical time college. And I wish I knew this in college. Like you can do a lot of business at your college and you can leverage the hell out of the resources that the college has. They've been around here for a long time. They have an impact within the community. They have a lot of connections. I didn't know to be like wheeling and dealing within my college and then leaving 4 or 5 years later, I clicked and I had to go back and develop these relationships with my own school to help them get me influence in the community, where I could have had a lot more pull if I had done that while I was in college. And you can align your brand with your college, it's going to give you a lot of credibility. you're gonna build a lot more momentum. So like, leverage the resources that you have while you're here. It might not be getting lectures in the classroom. It might be going to the, you know, Dean or someone that's aligned with, your messaging or your brand and figuring out a way that your guys paths align and utilizing the massive impact and influence that this institution has to your advantage. One of the things that Jack did that I was very impressed with is he took me to Mass Maritime. We drove there and he's like, I want you to meet this professor. And we sat with this professor. He's retired. What a character. And we sat there and had this incredible conversation. And Jack, I could tell the relationship that he had with Jack, you know, was a very special relationship. But I have teachers that I had that I'm still friends with. Right? That I'm like, they said one thing, one message. That was an instant. That was five, six seconds of my life. But it was transformative and it changed my entire life. There are things that, you know, people you're going to run into. They're going to change your entire life with one thing they say, but you have to have the alertness for you got to be ready for it, you know what I mean? And so those are the things that like, sometimes we take those for granted, those things. If I was to ask you guys right now, just think about this question for a second, like, give me the ten most successful seconds of your entire life, right? It could be a minute. It could be an hour. It could be. But give me that feeling of those 10s where you felt the most successful you've ever been in your entire life. Think about that for a second, because it's those moments, right? Those special moments that define your life. It's not an hour or 2 or 3 days, months, years. It's those tiny little moments that reveal the way the rest of your life is going to go that give you those messages right? I mean, you think about like, you know, you run into the love of your life and you're going to get married and you're going to you're going to pop the question. You're like, you don't like you have the revelation, an epiphany, a sudden moment. You're like, I'm going to get my kids for the rest of my life. And so that level of intuition and being, having that awareness and that readiness, right, is where learning occurs, right? It's it's about that kind of deep concentration of them and self-reflection and being ready to accept that message. Right. So what a privilege it is for you to be in this environment. Don't ever underestimate anything or anyone or any situation. Be ready to absorb and you'll be amazed at how that world you start to bring in those things. Like it's no accident when people call me out of the blue, I'm going to go make Tim Draper, Tim Draper start a Skype, start all these businesses, you can look them up online. $2 billion worth. They call me out of the blue. That goes, hey, we want you to sit down and dinner. So I'm on my way to Boston tomorrow. Right. How do you get to me? How do you know Louis? How do you know what I do? Like? It's not an accident I'm attracting, right? I'm building. And it's part of my brand. It's part of my message. It's part of my awareness. When I talk to somebody, I talk to this guy for an hour. He's saying I got somebody for you. To me, you know what I mean? Because I was aware I was ready, you know what I mean? And so getting deep, deep about your messages with people, you know, college, it's, you know, like, Jack, we, you know, he'll take me out to the bars and something like that. I'm not really having a good time because I want to engage people. I want to learn about people. So I want to be in a situation. We were just with a famous artist down in Miami. She's an incredible person, right? He asked, you were asking question after question about the significance of her paintings, right. And so it was fascinating because she was ready, she was ready to go into that deep conversation and take the risk and tell us her vulnerability, where her strength comes from, her inspiration comes from her fears. She just went all in. So developing that just opens the world. Don't be like, oh, I'm vulnerable. So I'm just going to protect myself. Like, what does that do? You know what I mean? That that's just going to shut somebody off that doesn't get to see, you know, your strength comes from that vulnerability even in business. Like, I've been with friends in the business being like, they look around, they go, I'm definitely the dumbest person in this room. And everybody laughs, goes, Holy shit, no, he's too strong because he's so comfortable with not knowing. And like one of the best skills you can learn. To follow up on that, especially in sales, is how to ask good questions. you know, that's how you're going to identify people's needs, build rapport with people, connect with people, identify opportunities, recognize where there's connections, is by being able to ask a really good question. So that's like top tier skill. And I looked at you had a follow up question. It was so schools about new opportunities and effort. Why don't you agree. Some areas would have a stronger and more opportunity. So to that work I could say for my example why we said you'd see a million businesses going on, a million people, so much is happening. Why not? Go to an environment that's more lively like that. And so I called, listen, man, there's no right answer here. Like you got to. You got to trust your convictions. If everything's pulling at you saying like, why am I here? Like, there's more opportunity that lies ahead. then go with your convictions. But the case that I think both of us are trying to make is like, there's opportunity everywhere. Like you have to look at. There's the 100% value here. but just where are your options if your convictions are. I have more opportunity here, and I'm. Why are you staying here? You know, like, ask yourself, like, why are you here and you're not there? Is it a limitation that's being instilled on you because your parents are telling you to stay, or because your peers are telling you it's the right path, then, like, that's not really a good reason to be here. And then look at like, what are the pros of being here? And then weigh them with the pros versus cons of going somewhere else and then make your decision. there is no like right answer to that. And I think it's like really studying like, you know, how committed are you to your internal journey, right? Like Nelson Mandela was in jail for, I don't know, 30 years, I think imagine the internal journey that he went through being jailed unlawfully. He was in a jail, you know, six by six feet with clothes, walls. Right. Think about the discipline that he needed to have, you know, Tibetan monks, when they all they do is sit in silence and they meditate and they eat, sleep, meditate. Right. So, like how advanced are you in your internal journey and how much momentum can you build with that internal journey? It's not about the external. I think now you know, get that knowledge base and really travel and get to know yourself more than your external is not going to change your internal. Right. I mean, the way that you build yourself is going to help you to perceive the external in a more powerful way. Does that make sense? Yes. You know, like, you know, I don't go to a place I'm like, I, I, I want to study as much as I can, how I'm perceiving and how I can open my perception to a place. I mean, I'm not expecting the place to influence me in a way that's changing my internal. It's it's kind of the opposite. I don't need to be a student and become more and more aware and have the discipline to be like, I'm really going to study my environment here. Does that make sense? Yes. Yeah. Your internal mindset really does generate your external reality. And like that's why that process is so important. Because like if you're committed to that plan, your reality is going to change to meet that goal. And like I mean he hates when I talk about this stuff because he thinks it's a woo. He believes in it, but he doesn't like being looked at like a hippie. But, but I like to talk about this, like experiment that they did. I think it was called the Institute of Noetic Sciences there in, California. They took a room. I'll just give this real quick. They took a room and they divided it up into nine quadrants, like a tic tac toe board. Right. And each square had a corresponding number attached to it. So it's like a tic tac toe board. 123456789. Can you envision that? And at the top of the room there was a plant. Grow light like a light for growing plants. And it was attached to a random number generator. So a random number generator is like a computerized coin flip. And I don't know if you guys have done like the experiment, you probably did it in middle school or something where you flip a coin and you tally if it landed on heads or tails. And the longer that you do it, the closer the distribution becomes to 5050, right? As expected. So when they did this experiment, their data set was 1 to 9. And as expected, the longer that they ran the experiment and flip the coin for more, even it it chose nine as it did to one as it did to five. The closer that distribution became to, even as expected, what they did then was they introduced a houseplant into one of the squares, and that houseplant needs light to grow. And what they found, which was profound. What they, observed was that the data, the majority of the time, would start skewing dramatically to the square with the House plan on it. There's no connection between that random number generator and the plant. But somehow, I mean, maybe it's accident. maybe it's like, coincidence. But when they observed it, somehow this plant was like, the implications are that it's basically bending probabilities at the quantum level in the basement layer of reality to get this light that it needs, like, and they're like proving essentially manifestation. Like if you are determined with everything to achieve your goal, reality and the probabilities of the world, they're going to start bending in your favor. But if you're like half in and half out, like you're going to be at the mercy of the external. So start generating your reality from the inside out. Does that make sense? What I said, yeah. And I think, you know, when I talk a lot about like language patterns, you know, and so like when you meet somebody, see their life, study their language patterns and study yours. But when people say, oh, I'm frustrated, I can't do this. And they use negative language, you know, or people that talk about other people and problems in this versus like ideas versus like positive things, like you're going to find that you're going to like, meet people that have a lot of limitations and other people that, you know, they don't have those limitations. And so understanding your language patterns is is something very important as well, because you've got to be relentless about that mindset that I always talk about, like happiness is a discipline. Why? Because it's not every day you're going to get up and be happy. But if you get up every day and go, this is going to be an extraordinary day. I'm going to be super inspired. And like, I practice this, I get up every day and I'm pumped. And I mean, I'm going 100, you know, I'm going on a hundred miles an hour. And my kids are like, oh God, mom, please. I can't handle him. Today. You know, I'll drink my coffee and I'm like, bam, let's go. Right. So happiness is a discipline and it's like discipline in your mind, right? To have positive thoughts. It's like I was reading a book about Michael Phelps and I was a swimmer in college. And so imagine training 20 years for 1/52 race. Do you think that the day he gets up he can afford like on I feel quite right, 20 years, one race. So he's got to train his mind that every day, no matter what, is the greatest day of his life. You know what I mean? Because you never know when that's your opportunity and you've been preparing that mindset for that opportunity. Does that make sense? Yet a phrase that you've taught me is like, which instant do you want to become? Your eternity? Like, really, all that exists is the present. So pick the instant that you want to experience for the rest of your life, whatever that is, how you feel, who you want to be around, like the lifestyle that you want to live in and then live it. Like why would you choose to live any other way? And I see so many people like living unhappily and like in a way that they wouldn't want to be living, and it's their choice. They could change it just like that. And, and it's a, you know, I mean, like, it's not that easy. Like some people are so deep with their limitations that it's difficult to get out of that cycle. But really, they do have the choice to get out of it and like, pick that instant that you want to be your eternity and live it every single day. You mentioned, that you, you know, you you used to drink, you used to smoke and it took you a while to kind of make that jump and decide not to do it. And maybe, I don't know, like with friends and maybe you, you know, weren't hanging out with the right people, like, what made you make the jump and actually, you know, say, I'm going to do this and and it's going to happen. Well, I knew it was limiting me. Now I realize, like, now I don't miss it at all because, like, I realize how powerful the mind is at like generating that reality. And I don't want to cloud any of my brain because, like, so I went three years when I started my company without drinking or smoking or doing anything like that. Then last summer I was like, okay, I've done it for like a while now. Like maybe I can go back to this and I realize, like, I literally watched the, like, power of my mind dissipate from my body again. so last week was one year again. last September, that was like two days ago, September 1st. was when I quit last year again. And I've done another year and it took me like six, seven, eight months to get back to that, like manifestation power that I had, prior to that. but, I mean, it's like it took me training and practice to get back to the point where I could like because I learned how to socialize and be extroverted, like drinking and partying. now I'm like, I mean, this weekend I did two nights till 5 a.m. in Miami. Like ripping it up. I was partying with Quavo this weekend, you know, like like we were going after it, but I wasn't drinking. Like I was talking business with guys. I was networking with guys like artists with musicians like. And I'm on a level that I can like, you know, I'm not making a fool out of myself. I'm building trust with these people. Like it has a lot of influence and and, power to have the, to be grounded enough to not give in to what everyone else is doing. And, like the best advice I got from an early mentor that really clicked that into my brain, he was like, if you want to be successful, look around at your peers and do the exact opposite of what they're doing. So like, that was that was what I did. You know, like I was like, okay, this is really obviously limiting a lot of people. Now some people can moderate it. Me, I do go 100% on anything I do. So like doesn't work out for me, but it might not be for everyone. But I think that it's like there's a lot of things that cloud your mind, and the more that you can get your like mind pure, the more powerful you'll be. And it's crazy to me that, like most people after 16, 17 years old, will never again go back to that childlike purity and intuition. And it's like, almost seems like maybe I'm a conspiracist, but it seems like there's like a reason for that, you know, because, like, seeing the power that you have without it, it's like, I don't know if it would be good for the, powers that be if everyone, you know wielded that. But it's my guess, along with, like, the drinking and smoking thing or like some other habits that you we decided to cut out in order to get to the next level. Those are the biggest ones. Like, literally everything followed after that. When I got that out, it was like everything else became easy. I still have bad habits, but I have like ruthless at like, worst procrastinator ever. so like, I just have, like, you know, little like habits, like every single day I wake up and do some sort of work, like I put myself into an environment that doesn't have a lot of distractions and, like, get worked on, make calls like, those are habits that I've instilled, like doing a to do list as like a habit that keeps me on track. There's like little habits like that. But if you can quit, like, in my opinion, if you can quit drinking and smoking like you're fucking, you're going to be sad. I think one of the things that, I was lucky because I was an athlete, so I've been a competitive athlete pretty much all through my early teens and late, some in the college. And like for me, I understand my energy levels. You know, like, this is really late for me. I would be chillin right now, but I get up at four in the morning and work till eight. That's kind of my sweet spot. So I get four hours of work there by the time 12 runs around, I've got eight hours, right? And then I try and make my decision from 4 to 8, and I don't make any other decisions after eight because I have input contamination. Right. So if I have a major decision to make, I don't make it. I do three, four in the afternoon because I'm already contaminated. I'm not at my ultimate, you know, thinking ability. So I'll wait till the next day to think about that decision. You see what I mean? So timing your energy level and your most efficient right brain power, thought power is key, right? sticking to it. You know, if you're there's people that are nocturnal. But sometimes I question that that nocturnal. They're not really at their full energy level, you know what I mean? Like, I'll time my meetings for a specific time that I know I'm at my highest energy level. Like, I'll never do a major meeting after 12 because I could have eaten lunch. And then I'll slow down on my energy level. So I'll always like, you know, there's a lot of business guys that do this. So studying your energy level is key because you can work one hour and do what people takes eight hours to do. You can do it in one hour because you're in that level of concentration. And getting that out of the way during a day is key. That makes sense. Yeah, we're probably like getting close to the end of the time here. But if you guys have more like we are nowhere to be at. I love answering questions like this. So if you have more questions, like if you have somewhere you have to be, don't feel fat. We won't be offended if you got to go when you're when you're working. And you you mentioned earlier that your mind tricks you into thinking you're about the right person. Charlie, don't. If anyone else does like I'll be out like throwing a podcast and like, oh, I'm being productive. But deep down I'm really no, I'm not either. What do you personally do yourself to get over that obstacle of your brain tricking me into being productive? Be like, write something down. Or I think, like kind of, for me at least, like just going through the motions. I'm always going to do less than, I plan to do. so I think like a good practice is to like, plan what you're going to do ahead of time and then stick to your plan. so say this is what I want to execute. This is the input that is going to get me to that goal and then actually do it. So then you can hold yourself accountable to that. that's like a good practice that you can go through. But for me, like, I just have to be I can't be in my room because within ten minutes I'm like, oh, I got to do my laundry and I get distracted. Like, the library is a really good place to work. Like, for me at least. because it's super quiet, like when I find myself in the library, it's time to bring myself there. But when I get there, I get a lot of work done because there's very little distractions. You gotta give yourself metrics like, so as an entrepreneur, I'm like, we always have revenue as target goals, right? One of the exercises that I do with when I teach entrepreneurship is like, okay, you got six months. I'm only going to allow you to work three hours for six months. What are you going to do to make $1 million? And people get stuck. They go, what do you mean? But you've only got three hours. We're gonna fool around and I'll do it. I'll do it for a week. But people are like, we're just going to fool around. We're going to go surf. We're going to go fish. I'm not going to let you work. You've only got one hour to work and you got to make $1 million. What are you going to do? So they start thinking, I would do this. I would call this person, you know, they they start getting anxiety and they would like and they totally become so productive in that hour, right, that they write down all the things that are going to be super high impact, right, and that are going to bring in that money. Go imagine if you did that for, you know, 4 or 5 hours a day, every day that I need. So that's a way to kind of create yardsticks in your head. Like like I always have a number in my head and I'm always like, I have to make this much money by December. I always have number. If you don't have a number, you won't get it then. I mean, so you have to like create processes to make sure you're hitting those goals. So have specific measurable goals and put the steps in place no matter what. You know, like I don't want to be working 80 hours a week anymore. So I try to put myself the calls that I get on like I don't want to on a call, have there. There has to be a possibility that I can make at least six figures on that phone call. I want to be in, a call that there's a chance to be making over a million. but then if I do enough of those calls, like one of them is going to hit, my conversion rate is probably like one out of, like 10 or 15 of those, like, opportunities. And we have a sales team that generates those opportunities. But by the time they come to me, like, I want to be spending my time on an hour long call that has the opportunity to make at least six figures on that phone call. Now. It took a lot of hours to get to that communication level, to where I can close a six figure,$1 million deal on a single phone call. But you don't have to. You can figure out how to do that over 20 years, or you can go down to Panama. I spent eight months with Jose Goldner and, and, and, you know, find find a guy that is doing it, you know, doing $1 million deals, like in a meeting and learn his skills and then apply those. And, you know, within 2 or 3 years, you know, within two years, I got to that point. So that's like the kind of a mentorship thing is like putting your ego aside and like learning from someone because you can put yourself in another echelon really quickly by gathering the knowledge that they've picked up over the last 20 or 30 years. And then I think now the girls have asked any questions. Any questions? No comment. You guys on the spot for. Now, I have like the goal. Like I have like that entrepreneur mindset. And right now I'm trying to like solidify by exactly what I want to do because I'm not sure, like, there's so many different things that I want to do and want to pursue, but I know I can't do all of them. Do you have any guidance to how I figure that out? Well, I'll use one of my mentors and, you know, works with Jose at the bank. Roger Robertson talks about the like Navy Seal, 8020 rule. Like if you wait the Navy Seals when they are 80% like sure about something they make a move if you things are moving way too fast. And if you wait until you're 100% sure, things will move and you'll miss opportunities. So, like, find something that you're 80% sure about and then just jump in like you might not be like where you end up in five years. But like the worst thing you can do is sit there like waiting for the perfect opportunity. Like just jump in on something, you're going to gain a lot of knowledge, and you're going to get closer to figuring it out, like what your actual purpose is. yeah. An entrepreneurship. You know, I love to to say this, like out of ten things, but I've tried, I've been I've failed at nine, you know what I mean? And like, you just have to be so resilient and, like, not look at failure, like. But there are things that I failed that, you know, and and like 3 or 4 years later, they were relevant. And I was like, oh my God, that's why I went bankrupt over here to use it over here. You know what I mean? So there's things that you can embark on that teach you things that you think are like, well, that didn't work. But then it becomes totally relevant to your new business. Like digital. I had a digital, agency. We did digital advertising back in the day, and everybody was like, what do I need a website? Back to that? And I was like, oh my God. And I just couldn't break through the learning curve of why people needed a website. Imagine, right? Today it's like you don't exist if you have a website, but it was so-so. But then like years later, it was like, wow. I was trying to convince people back then and now everybody's like doing. And I'm like, I'm done with that. But then it became relevant, right? So never think have the mentality of like, I did this business and I failed. And you don't have another arrow in your quiver. You do. But what he said is very important. Like go out and don't just do it right, try it and go all the way, and you're going to learn. And if you don't make it, do it again. And don't ever let your mind, you know, limit you. Any other questions? Yeah. This is awesome. Thank you guys. And you guys always have. the.